- Read Chapter 2 of Harris’ Rewriting, “Forwarding.” By writing group, craft a reflection focused on a specific section of Harris’ text and responding to Foucault.
- Writing Group 1: page 34-38
- Writing Group 2: page 38-43
- Writing Group 3: page 43-47
- Writing Group 4: page 48-51
- Writing Group 5: page 49-53
- Respond to Wordpress post the main point(s) of your section, along with one clear quote from the section. Also include (1) question you have from reading Foucault, and (1) way, you see from the text, that it seems like he might be “forwarding” himself.
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In forwarding your focus tends to be on where you are headed as a writer, its occurs quick. You use what you can from the text and more on. But when countering you’re often left having to tell more of the background story, it has to be slow and careful. Extending another text can be risky, you can go too far and misinterpret ideas.
“willingness to take chances, to rewrite the terms and ideas of others, to make them your own” p.51
“instead we must locate the space left empty by the authors disappearance, follow the gaps and openings” p.209 this shows me forwarding.
my question is can you integrate your own symbols?
Foucault Question and Forwarding Occurrence
– To what extent does Foucault believe in the Death of the Author? First he mentions it as portrayed by Barthes, but then he talks about then talks about the “classificatory function” of the author’s name. Is his view more accepting than Barthes’?
– Foucault forwards in his piece when he mentions that author’s names raise problems like any other proper name does, since he “[refers] to Searle’s analyses, among others” while he develops his own argument.
Harris “Forwarding” main points and quotes (Group 4: page 48-51)
– His first main point (page 48) is to demonstrate the possibilities of extending another author’s work by exemplifying it.
– His second main point touches on the challenges of using the strategies he described in the chapter in conjunction.
– Finally, he once again chooses to use an example to illustrate his point; in this case, one that successfully uses various types of forwarding despite the difficulty of doing so.
“A problem with offering advice about writing, though, is that while you can isolate certain moves that writers make, they rarely make those moves in isolation. In the course of an ambitious piece of writing, you are likely to forward the work of others in multiple and overlapping ways […]. And this does not even begin to consider the ways in which you will also probably need in the same piece to come to terms with or counter yet other texts.”
Group 5
Harris:
He talks about the different types of forwarding and how forwarding can be easily messed up. He also uses a reference from Barbara Ehrenreich as an example of a author using different types of forwarding.
“A problem with offering advice about writing, though, is that while you can isolate certain moves that writers make, they rarely make those moves in isolation”
Foucault:
He seems to make references to previous things he made and then expound on it, drawing more inferences from it.
Can skilled writer become the author as well?
Harris:
Harris describes academic writing as a form of conversation where you use an original piece of work to add to your own argument that is directed at other readers of the original work. In his words, “academic writing is often described as a kind of conversation” (34). By participating in this sort of academic conversation you are “forwarding” work conceived by another author to other participants. The process of forwarding requires a change of context so that the words written by another author add to your argument. After the change of context is made, the focus of readers is now pushed away from the original work and towards your own arguments.
Foucault:
Foucault discusses the difference between scientific writing as compared to other forms of literature to show the importance of the author in the credibility of a scientific piece around the time of Enlightenment. The name of the scientist gives his work credibility so that when a reader sees that the scientist proposes an idea, they take it as fact. Does this also apply to authors such as Shakespeare whose work is fictional but extremely well known?
Foucault forwards himself by briefly referencing Barthes when discussing the role of the author and how it has changed through history. He is adding himself to the same conversation as Barthes by discussing the role of the author in writing.
Forwarding is using the work of another author in order to either help the point they are trying to prove or to authorize the point. It can help two different styles of speech come together.
Four types of forwarding are illustrating, authorizing, borrowing, and extending.
Forwarding is used for “strategies, moves, [and] ways of advancing your own project as a writer” (149).
Countering is very different from forwarding, “The work of countering a text tends to be slow and careful. The pace of forwarding is usually quicker, its touch lighter. Its aim is to take what is useful from a text and move on” (52).
Foucault advances himself by saying that the previous questions asked about authors are irrelevant, instead more complex and advancing questions should be asked: “In short, it is a matter of depriving the subject (or its substitute) of its role as originator, and of analyzing the subject as a variable and complex function of discourse” (221).
Writing is like entering a conversation that has already started. The metaphor ” suggests that the goal of such writing is not to have the final word on the subject to bring the discussion to a close, but to push it forward” (35).
In an academic conversation students usually never write to the author, they write for other readers in the discussion. The student is “ forwarding the authors ideas to the readers in order to persuade them.
He is forwarding because he is using some of Barthes’ ideas to create his own argument
1. We need to have convincing evidence in our texts, so that the readers can trust our work and take our word for it.
2. Gitlin uses “forwarding” as a way to move into a subject. A writer may use forwarded texts to make an outline through images and examples.
3. We use forwarding to suggest the process of thought, moving from example to example to prove our point.
4. Authorizing is a part of critical writing and it means to look at another text for a key word or concept. This can be a voice of authority for other writers.
5. Borrowing suggests that we use other texts to not only support our point but also to advance our work by borrowing a term or an idea from a work by another writer.
6. Extending suggests that we add to other people’s work by adding to its range of meanings. Our goal is not to criticize, but to add on with a view of another perspective.
“The literate person, Pattison sugggests, realizes that words never simply describe the world but rather always offer a particular view of it, and thus that we can use language to shape beliefs and events- for both good and ill.” (43)
What does the author mean by “discourses are objects of appropriation”? What is “penal appropriation”? (211)
Foucault is forwarding by saying that rather than focusing on the author, we should ask more sophisticated questions and “study discourses not only in terms of their expressive value or formal transformations but according to their modes of existence”. (220)
Harris:
Harris highlights how “forwarding” does not intend to end the discussion or close the topic but rather to contribute a new context to the discussion. This eventually will result in more discussions and debates about the specific topic.
p.37 “a writer forwards a text by taking words, images, or ideas from it and putting them to use in new contexts”
Foucault:
If an author references a other authors in his/her work, can it still be considered the author’s own work? Or would the author’s work be considered a conglomeration of other authors’ works?
Foucault tries to “forward” himself by offering new perspectives on what it means to be an author, how an author’s works should be classified and what defines work.
Group 5
Forwarding:
Harris shows the use of number of different strategies of forwarding with an example of Barbara Ehrenreich’s writing, in which Ehrenreich well establishes the authority of the author of work she cited. In addition, Harris warns the risk of extending other’s text by saying that the extent of forwarding can often go too far that it can mislead the audience.
Foucault:
He wants “to call for a form of culture in which fiction would not be limited by the figure of the author.” (222) He argues that too much attention on author rather than a work itself “impedes the free circulation…and recomposition of fiction.”(221)
Group 2
“When you forward an idea or passage from another text you need to simply cite it but use it” Page 39
Main Points
-shift focus from what author has to say toward your own project
-4 ways of shaping ideas and material into your own: illustrating, authorizing, borrowing, and extending
-impetus for most project lies not in specific text but on a question or idea the author wants to explore
-you need texts to use in thinking about your subject
-make their work yours
Focault uses forwarding when he talks about the death of the author and makes it his own interpretation about the disappearance of the author
As Focault utilizes others ideas such as Barthes death of the author and makes them his own, does that still make Focault an author? Or is he not an author?
Harris (Group 3):
“You can call on other text not simply to support but to advance your work as a writer through “borrowing” a term or idea from another writer to use in thinking through your subject”
– Writers turn to another text for a key word or concept
– You can advance your writing by borrowing a term from another writer
– Selecting, excerpting, commenting, and, sometimes, changing or inflecting the meaning of texts makes your text more exciting.
Focault:
Based on what Focault is writing, what is the difference between an author and an inventor?
Focault is forwarding himself when he uses De Viris illustribus to illustrate his point that Christian exegesis used the saintliness of an authors name to prove the value of a text.
Group 4
Main Points:
-Harris talks about the genius of famous people and how their different “key descriptive words” carried Garber to a whole new place; she built upon their influences.
-Then, he discusses the four types of forwarding (as seen in the quote below) and gives an example of Ehrenreich’s writing.
-Harris discusses Ehrenreich’s “intellectual” writing of the educated middle class, which he praises.
“In this chapter I’ve identified four types of forwarding: illustrating, authorizing,
borrowing, and extending.” (49)
Foucault says that ethics have not necessarily improved, it is just simply less transparent so we do not see all the evils (like in the prison system for example). Just because something is part of the establishment and less transparent, does that mean old forms of punishment (like public shaming or execution) is better?
In a way, Foucault is always forwarding the work of his mentor, Nietzsche. Specifically in this reading, he is forwarding Karl Marx, on page 217.
Main Points:
– We can use language to shape beliefs and events
– Authorizing: Texts are sources of terms and ideas as well as images and examples which can be voice of authority for writers
– Borrowing: we use other texts to support our points and advance our work by borrowing ideas or terms from other writers
– Extending: using other writers ideas to further extend outward and push his idea further and beyond
“‘The spectacle of excess’ was how Barthes explained the allure of professional wrestling , describing its matches as mock, exaggerated battles between good and evil that fans can at once laugh at and revel in.” (pg. 47)
If Focault considers writing as linked to death, does he consider work to be synonymous to death? or does he just believe it “possesses the right to kill”? How does he differentiate writing from work?
Focault forwards himself when he discusses his idea of work.
Harris discusses “forwarding” as the addition of an original work to your own argument. This not only strengthens your own argument, but also forwards the conversation into new topics and ideas. On page 36 Harris states, “You don’t win a conversation, you add to it, push it ahead, keep it going, and maybe even sometimes redirect or divert the flow of talk.”
On pages 210-211 Foucault discusses the importance of the author’s name. I wonder what other factors an author’s name has on a work?
Foucault forwards himself by asking questions that further the conversation rather than focus on himself.
Writing Group 2 (38-42):
Main points:
-There are four ways of shaping purpose in writing: illustrating, authorizing, borrowing and extending
– Illustrating takes examples from other texts to explain the writer’s point.
– Authorizing is when you cite another writer’s expertise to explain a point
– Borrowing is taking another writer’s point to explain your own.
– Extending is taking concepts from another writer and putting “your own spin” on it.
– You must cite other author’s work.
– Your understanding of another’s work must be thorough so that you don’t misrepresent the ideas.
“The more confi dence your readers have in your descriptions of such texts, the more they are also likely to credit your uses and interpretations of them.”
Foucault question: Is an author really needed to explain a text in literature? Context helps, but isn’t there merit to the blank slate idea as well?
Foucault forwarding: Foucault appears to be forwarding in the sense that he references Barthes’ idea of history in an author. While Barthes argues that history shouldn’t be considered, Foucault acknowledges that it’s needed to analyze work.
Main points:
-there are four types of forwarding: illustrating, authorizing, borrowing, and extending
-illustrating provides you with information to think about, such as data, anecdotes, scenarios, etc.
-after using illustrating, you still have to put it in your own words effectively
“You can’t reproduce a television ad or a movie scene on the page in the way you can recopy the words of a print text.” pg.41
One question I have from reading Foucault is, to what extent does he define “work” in the writing process?
An example of forwarding Foucault might be using is on page 206, when he refers to “The Thousand and One Nights” to try to reinforce his point.
-Four types of forwarding: illustrating, authorizing, borrowing and extending..
“In the course of an ambitious piece of writing, you are likely to forward the work of others in multiple and overlapping ways: to call on some text as sources of authority, to draw on others for examples, to borrow ideas or extend phrasings from still others.” (49)
Someone already posted this but what is the difference between the author and an inventor. Do inventors “die” after they finish their work as well?
He uses Barthes work to make his own argument, which means he is forwarding. (Death of the author, etc)
Writers turn to another text for concepts and keywords.
Your writing can improve by borrowing terminology from others people’s writings
Using another writer’s ideas to further extend your idea is a good writing tactic.
“I’d argue that writing tends to become more exciting as it moves outward—selecting, excerpting, commenting, and, sometimes, changing or inflecting the meanings of the texts it brings forward.”
What does Foucalt mean when he says “discourses are objects of appropriation”?
Foucalt uses forwarding because he is expanding on some of Barthes’ ideas.
Main Points:
-Forwarding: shift the focus of the readers away from what the author has to say and towards your own thoughts
-4 ways of shaping others purposes to form your own:
1. Illustrating- look at other texts for examples of a point you want to make
2. Authorizing- invoke the expertise of another writer to support your thinking
3. Borrowing- draw on ideas from other writers to use in thinking through your subject
4. Extending- put own spin on terms or concepts taken from other texts
-“You need to somehow make their work your yours” (41)
– “… you need to interpret as you describe, to re-present the text in a way that shows how it illustrates the point you want to argue” (41)
Foucault:
-Foucault shows forwarding as he says, “it would be worth examining how the author became individualized in a culture like ours, what status he has been given, at what moment studies of authenticity and attribution began…” (205). This shows how he is shifting the main focus away from simply what the author has to say and looking at the work through a deeper lens.
-Should an author give credit to other authors works that he used as references or is in not necessary since they used it to make their own?
“Forwarding” is the act of continuing conversation from which sprouts more conversation. To forward, you must actually change the context of the conversation so as to shift the focus from the original work to the actual arguments you are making.
“Learning a subject means acquiring a discourse, not just mastering a body of knowledge.” This quote perfectly exemplifies the importance of forwarding on page 35.
Main points
illustrating, authorizing,
borrowing, and extending.” (49)
In the course of an ambitious piece of writing, you are likely to forward the work of others in multiple and overlapping ways: to call on some texts as sources of authority, to draw on others for examples, to borrow ideas or extend phrasings from still
others
He talks about the type of forwarding, and how he loves middle class writing because it looks more intellectual. He speaks on the the authors work can be worked on to make it better.
He uses challeneges to talk about strategies.
Foulcault says that ethics are transparent like a prison. But it is like a game.
He questions a writer if they can write as well as an author.
“Forwarding” Main Points (p.48-51)
– arriving at your own separate position as a writer
– four types of forwarding: illustrating, authorizing, borrowing, and extending.
– community and its discourse must be recognized to rethink the assumptions we bring to our attempts to listen to the speech of others
Quote: “Extending another text can be risky work. There is always the chance that you’ll go too far, misappropriate the ideas or phrasings of another writer. Is a spectacle of subtleties…”
Foucault
Question: Do we find a better understanding of the author or better interpret his work in the openings left by his disappearance?
Foucault forwards the work of Nietzsche (p.207) and explains that there is a separation between “work” and writing. So where do we draw the distinction?